Let’s back up and address one thing before moving on. A big question that needs to be addressed is “are we a Christian nation?” Or more appropriate: “where we a Christian nation?” I think most people would answer the first question with a resounding NO. But what about our beginnings? There is evidence that some of the founding fathers were strong believers in Christ.
On my book shelve there is a book of essays written by a Presbyterian pastor named John Witherspoon. In his book he writes on topics such as regeneration and justification. If you are a Christian you may recognize these terms in the theological sense, as being regenerated “in Christ” and being justified “before God”. The reason I bring him up is because if you look at the bottom of a copy (or the original if you go to D.C.) of the declaration of independence then you my notice a signature of a man named John Witherspoon. Same guy!
Also on my book shelve you will find a book on John Adams by David McCullough. John Adams also signed the declaration. The book contains letters Adams and his wife Abigail wrote to each other while John was off building a nation. In one particular one Abigail wrote about an epidemic that broke out in there home town, she suggested that it was because God was punishing them for allow slavery to take place in America. The book does a good job of pointing out the faith that John and Abigail shared in Christ.
And you can find other people who had a hand in forming this country with similar stories as Witherspoon and Adams. But I would like to interject this in the argument: it dose not matter about their faith, because when the helped form the nation they did not start a church or religious organization, they started a country. One based on freedom of religion I’ll grant you but not a church.
If you read about the reasons we went to war with England most will point back to taxes. There were other reasons but mainly it was because of “taxation without representation”. Which flies in the face of Romans 13:1-2: “Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that have been instituted by God. Therefore whoever resists the authorities, resist what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment”. So the colonists were sinning against God by warring with England. And also contradicts Jesus in Matthew 22:21: “Therefore render to Caesar things that are Caesar’s”.
I know this is not popular to say in most circles, but any rebellion or revolution cannot be biblically justified, unless the rebellion is for the purposes of avoiding sin. And tax evasion I don’t think can be classified as avoiding sin.
But wait! Our money says “In God We Trust”. This is true. But what I would object with is it never says “in God the Father” we trust. Or “in Christ we trust”. In other words it’s an ambiguous, impersonal type of title for the creator of heaven and earth. It might as well say “in the Man upstairs we trust”.
So no, I would not say America was ever a Christian nation. It was formed from rebellion which is not a Christian teaching. But in light of my words and thoughts I love my county, I really do. I think it’s the best one going. Why do you think we have immigration issues? No body wants in to a lame party. God has really blessed us materially in a way I don’t think he has ever blessed any nation. And the Gospel can be talked about freely. But its not because we did any thing to incur these blessings, we deserve hell. He did it just because.
Next I think we should talk about CAN there be a Christian nation?
the idea of a christian nation in respect to the US is only on a cultural level because of its implementation of the freedom of religion. the founding fathers did not establish a theocracy, and neither do we still have one today. so culturally, a nation could be considered a christian nation if its populace is mostly Christian. the problem with this is that the nature of Jesus’ teaching was inherently subversive and anti-imperial. many would suggest this is one of the ways we misunderstand the biblical teaching of being in the world but not of it. being of the world would lead us to adopt its methods of control and power, leading us to take part in politics. I think this is more wrong in the eyes of god that the majority of our silly moral legalities that most members of this culture constantly focus on while supporting a government and its processes that is known for pursecution and manipulation world-wide.
Love it, worm. Very well said and I agree with you
And I dig amos’s comment. But I hate trying to comment on a blog with my blackberry…
Amos, could you explain this a little bit more: “the nature of Jesus’ teaching was inherently subversive and anti-imperial”. I want to get a better grasp on what you were saying.
Thanks for reading and thinking about it guys.
worm- let me suggest books and dvd’s by david barton.
the handprint of God is all over our nation’s heritage.
Joe, its hard to say God didn’t have his hand in our forming. But what was formed? What did God create? I say he formed a country that let’s its people worship freely no matter what their religion is. But he did not form one big church.
When it came to religion, the cornor stone was not one particular religion but the freedom of any religion to be worshiped.
the cornerstone was Christianity, but not one particular denomination. again, read more of the original documents.
worm- thought you might be interested in this quote from Patrick Henry:
“It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religion, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Fro that reason alone, people of other faiths have been offorded freedom of worship here.”
What about this quote from Thomas Paine:
“All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit.”
-Thomas Pain, The Age of Reason.
Thomas Jefferson to a letter to John Adams said that he thought the miracles that Jesus did would be concidered myth one day:
“And the day will come, when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the Supreme Being as his father, in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter”
He also his own version of the Bible where he removed the miracles. Just Google “Thomas Jefferson Bible”.
And Ben Franklin said God did not desire our praise:
“I cannot conceive otherwise than that He, the Infinite Father, expects or requires no worship or praise from us, but that He is even infinitely above it.” Articles of Belief and Acts of Religion, 1728.
All these men helped form the nation in big ways. Thomas Paine wrote “Common Sense” which was a starter to the debate on independence for England. Thomas Jefferson penned the Declaration of Independence and was out third President. Ben Franklin served on the Continental Congress and was considered very influential.
But I still think when you hold the reveloutionary war to the standards of scripture, you are forced to say it was a sinful act. How can you not in light of Romans 13:1-7, and 1 Peter 2:13-17. In the american colonies situation, England and its king would be the authority, and the reveloution would be thier sin.
Excuse me instead of saying “He also his own version of the Bible where he removed the miracles. Just Google “Thomas Jefferson Bible”.
I meant to say “He also wrote his own version of the Bible where he removed the miracles. Just Google “Thomas Jefferson Bible”.
Amos, if you are still out there I would still like to hear your argument a little better.
WOW!!! you guys sure do know a lot about the history of our nation. I just want to say that we do have the freedom to vote for SOMEONE to lead our country and I think it our duty to vote. If you don’t vote then you have know right to complain about the state of our country. Even though the choices may not be great.
I thought that there were some religious freedoms being violated and that was some of the reason why they started a new nation. If they were being made to do something that was against christianity then it would be Biblical to fight for that, right? and lets not forget that we are all sinners, even our founding fathers. they made mistakes just like we do. Just because they started a war and didn’t want to pay taxes doesn’t mean they were not christians. it just means they were forgiven.
Hey Jamie.
True just because they didn’t want to pay taxes and started a war does not mean they were not Christian. That’s not my argument. My argument is how can the country be founded as a Christian country if all the formers were not professing christians (such as the 3 men mentioned above). I think the war just points out the fact that it was not a Christ centered endevor.
There were many reasons fore the war, religious freedom was one sighted but it was the biggest. The biggest was taxation without representaion (again not Christ centered). They didn’t want to be taxed, and thought they were much better off on their own.
And yes I think when the government has a law that would cause you to sin, then you don’t obey the law. You should obey God rather than men.
hey brian,
that is funny about the tax thing because we are taxed on EVERYTHING now.
i knew that some of those things i said didn’t really have much to do with your post. your post just made me think of those things and i am blonde sometimes times and thought you were saying they were christians. SORRY!
tell kay hey for me and remind her that she has a blog out there.